These past couple of days have been fascinating...especially if one has been trooping around the international news sites following reaction to the Israeli spy case, and Auntie Helen's later comments.
 
Most of the news reports have been very similar to Granny Herald. Probably that report was lifted (by agreement) by the international agencies and broadcast. Some of the more right wing, particularly one Israeli paper, have had additional local comment principally from the Israeli Foreign Minister.
No, once again the interest has been in the vox pop fora. Regrettably one has disappeared (from Friday) but this is from the same paper, with many of the same contributors (yep that is me post 2)
http://www.maarivintl.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=article&articleID=9841




14.
 

A lesson

 
 

IG, Canada(2004-07-16 11:26:19.937 EST)

 
 

To those Israelis who always blame themselves for everything: The bad guys hate you regardless of what you do so you might as well do what needs to be done and ignore the antisemites...


13.
 

How does New Zealander know??

 
 

Brian, Florida, USA(2004-07-16 11:16:25.763 EST)

 
 

How does the individual below know that the cemetery vandalism was a result of the "actions of a few"? Did you watch the desecration in progress? Perhaps the anti-Israel remarks by the prime minister unleashed latent anti-semitism in your country. If the war against Iraq is so unpopular around the world, then why aren't American cemeteries ever vandalized? Could it be that the USA is perceived as being strong while the Jews are perceived as being weak? Clark really overreacted in this case.


12.
 

Will Helen speak out now?

 
 

Brian, New York(2004-07-16 09:30:23.75 EST)

 
 

Helen Clark was quick to accuse the defendants for working for Mosad, but where is she in speaking out against these attacks? Perhaps her extremist left-leaning politics has gotten in the way? I wonder if Arafat would not be a desirable guest or would he simply be a freedom fighter?


11.
 

It's a hoax !

 
 

Peter, NZ(2004-07-16 08:53:07.607 EST)

 
 

Hearing the stories coming out of France of lies about anti-semetic attacks, I wonder if this act is also carried out by Mossad agents in order to divert attention and smear Kiwis. If not, Israel's stupid actions in Palestine and around the world DO provoke resentment to Jews. Israel, wake up and take the path to peace....


10.
 

New Zealand anti Israeli foreign policy

 
 

Semsem, New York, USA(2004-07-16 07:48:52.293 EST)

 
 

Let us not forget that New Zealand follows an anti Israeli foreign policy. The Foreign Minister met with Arafat. There is a lovely picture of him shaking Arafat's hand and gleeming with happiness. NZ also strongly blasted Israel in regards to Rafah and sent money to the Palestinians. NZ also historically discouraged Jewish emigration. It's a known fact.


9.
 

Typical

 
 

Roberta, London(2004-07-16 06:53:47.45 EST)

 
 

Typical behaviour of uncivilised people. They don't even know the guys are spies or Mossad agents. But nevertheless - Let's desecrate the jewish cemetery! These people have no knowledge of anything. Desecrating a cemetery might be an appaling thing to us, but the souls are up there laughing. You can only laugh at small people as they have no idea what awaits them in "the other side". God is watching too.


8.
 

Why - simple - trade with the Arab world

 
 

Sid, Yerushalim(2004-07-16 06:43:00.89 EST)

 
 

New Zealand supplies vast quantities of sheep to the Arab countries - they are attempting to show their erstwhile trade partners thier political position.


7.
 

NZ

 
 

Mark, Raanana(2004-07-16 04:23:53.077 EST)

 
 

So the NZ PM roiled the murky waters a little and all the scum floated to the top. Why am I not surprised?


6.
 

Wrong country!!

 
 

eloise lanum, HMB california(2004-07-16 03:55:35.013 EST)

 
 

"OH, OH! I don't think this looks like Jordan!!"


5.
 

kiwis

 
 

john, australia(2004-07-16 03:39:42.717 EST)

 
 

you can buy 10 kiwis passport for a $1 and be able to get change . Iam maried to one. all the kiwis are over here in droves


4.
 

JEW-THE ETERNAL VICTIM

 
 

Peter, SF.USA(2004-07-16 03:38:21.09 EST)

 
 

I knew it...I knew it.....that this was not the end


3.
 

Gross overreaction

 
 

Steve, Boston(2004-07-16 03:29:03.42 EST)

 
 

So two men who are citizens of another country try to steal passports, and new zealand decides to criticize all of israel for the actions of two random men who may or may not have anything to do with a security agency? ANd then jewish graves get vandalized? So if any citizens from new zealand do something wrong, should people say bad things about all of new zealand and violate the graves of the dead? Of course not, so why is that done to israel?


2.
 

Israeli spies, Mossad and Justice

 
 

the probligo, Auckland, New Zealand(2004-07-16 03:13:37.623 EST)

 
 

First, nothing can excuse the actions of a few when they take the form like that of the desecration of the cemetary in Wellington. Second, nothing can excuse the ham-fisted actions of the two Israelis, whether Mossad or not. And for those who would criticise our Prime Minister consider this... There is as much "justification" for her comments about Israel and the possible relationship between these two convicts and Mossad, as there ever was for the war against Iraq.


1.
 

New Zealand.

 
 

David Nigel Braham, info@cordusio.it(2004-07-16 03:00:43.903 EST)

 
 

If these two had been citizens from another country not a word would have been said.What they did was wrong and they will pay by going to jail.I find it hard to believe that they represented Israel's inteligence service the Mossad.Trying to obtain documents unlawfully goes on all the time in every country around the world. Madam Prime Minister,I think you over reacted.
 
 
I am amazed in some ways that the "actions of a few" - something disputed by "Brian of Florida" - in desecrating a Jewish cemetary can assume far greater importance than the background news item.
I regret the loss of contact with the other news item from the same newspaper as the vox pop debate there was getting into the realms of "what kind of justice system does NZ have?"
So, in the time remaining I want to concentrate on that...
First up, these two men were arrested about four months back.
In that intervening period I imagine that there has been some quite intense "correspondence" between Wellington and Tel Aviv.
Soon after their arrest there was (as is usual in this country) a remand hearing in Court.
Immediately after that hearing, Granny Herald published a lengthy and detailed "investigative reporting" piece on the case, including the now infamous quote "from a high placed government source" that the two were part of a team linked directly with Mossad.
Now to cut through all of the bullshit that has followed...
The two admitted charges that they were "members of an illegal organisation" (in NZ law that covers terrorist, organised crime, and environmentalist associations).
Significant, and unreported other than in direct radio interviews, other matters included the fact that the defence lawyers for the two were unaware of this charge, and the guilty pleas until the Court hearing on Thursday.
What does this mean? My guess is -

The two Israelis were given a choice? They could plead guilty to these much lesser charges or face full hearings on the more serious of document fraud, obtaining passport by deception, and perhaps even moving toward the terrorism charge. This is not a likely scenario, but the one I think the defence lawyers were anticipating.
The Crown Law Office (the top end of the legal prosecution system in this country) took a long hard look at the overall situation and offered the "way out". THIS is where I believe the truth to be found.
OK, why would the CLO take this approach?
The Israeli's strongest defence would have been provided by the Granny Herald article.
Where, in this country, could a jury now be found that had not read or heard at least in part the content of the articles published by the Granny. Absolutely nowhere. So the CLO would have been sitting on a powderkeg of "miscarriage of justice" claims followed in all rpobability by extensive wrongful imprisonment charges.
So to all of those americans who criticise NZ's system of justice (none of whom will likely pass this way) I say this...
Compare this case with the trial of Michael Jackson.
Which of those will receive true justice?