Sunday, July 02, 2006

Well, at least I know where I am welcome...


Well, this is a sad day indeed, one that I thought would never come to pass.

Originally, this post recorded a brief email exchange I had with an American gentleman (I am advised that is a sufficiently polite term for him) regarding the "rules and regulations" for posting at neo-neocon's blogsite.


Extensive cutting and pasting will be grounds for deletion. Repeated violations will lead to banning. Civility and staying on topic, that is not trying to highjack threads, is the preferred discussion method. From a review of your comments, I see several cases where you dance on the edge. Blanket condemnations without precise documentation and logical fallacies as found on this list can result in loss of commenting privileges. Trim your sails and you can still post. Go over the edge and you’re history.

I. BTW, am not a Neo-Con. I’m just an old fashioned Republican; what you would call a “Fascist” in your lexicon. I’ve met very few Kiwi’s in my extensive travel in your country who I would call friends of the US and, frankly, I don’t care what you think of us. For the nonce, and only because it suits our national interests, your country remains under our protection. Treaties are not eternal.

Now, to be fair to this gentleman, he was relatively polite in his insults. He got no worse than calling me a ponce; a term of approbation and endearment in his world I guess. At least, unlike some of the others of his ilk I have had the fortune to meet, he has stayed away from the sheep jokes.

I am removing this post, and a second, because I am not sufficiently vindictive to leave them remain.

What ever this gentleman's background, whatever his reasons, I have had a second series of emails on this same topic. They are written, quite politely, by a "security consultant" apparently engaged by Mr X.

He advises me that I stand to suffer all manner of dire consequences if I am not to remove these two posts. Well, Mr Security Consultant, your threats, and the blatant attempts at appealing to my better side - almost fawning in one instance - are a small part in this decision. Not because of the threats - I would just love to challenge them. No, you have reminded me that I am better than that.

So, to close this sorry chapter, and to all of the "security agents", IP complaint investigators, and others who seem to have been the majority of the traffic through the probligo's little world I have removed the remainder.

I suggest that your read no further, as the rest of this is intended for Mr X as a parting gift.


Mr X, sir.

I hope that all of your fears are realised. I hope that the causes of your paranoia and fear of life come to pass.

You, sir, are not a democrat by any stretch of the imagination.

You, sir, are not what I would call a "fascist" as you have suggested. You would have done well for yourself in the times before Magna Carta - when men were men and serfs were taken to battle for blood sports by the nobility. That is a trait that you have not lost.

Well sir, you tire me.

I leave you with the most powerful insult that I know -


My full name is

Bob Renner

I live at 19 La Perouse St in Howick, Auckland.


Hungry Valley said...

It might be a good idea to read your mail at the yahoo account.

neoneoconned said...

and there is me thinking i was the only one threatened with, contacting my ISP. It is actually quite easy to continue posting on neo's site but it gets a little dull as anything except false ids get removed.

have to say that I doubt i will be looking at neo's stuff except if I get any more hassle from them. I have reached the conclusion they are not very pleasant people and some are actually potentially violent.

It is interesting that a lot of the posters have been banned - right and left.

Unless it follows the true neo-con path it is not very welcome, and certainly not allowed through the great firewall of new england.



Hungry Valley said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Hungry Valley said...

It was noted by me and others that the entire email is not "published". the privacy statements have been excised.

Mr Renner, your full name and address were known to us prior to your update. We could have put them in comments at any time but refrained due to respect for your privacy.

neoneoconned uses a sort of proxy server/mixmaster method to get around Haloscan security. Only some information information regarding his IP range was posted in comments. His actual IP address and other information known to us was not posted due to our policies reagrding his privacy.

At no time did anyone threaten to contact his ISP the partial posting of his IP range and the owner of that range were simply to indicate to him that his information was known to us.

neoneoconned said...

why am i not surprised that neoneocon turns out to have intolerant, threatening and authoritarian friends....

hope she is pleased with them

hope they enjoy telling each other how lovely they are.

The probligo said...

"It was noted by me and others that the entire email is not "published". the privacy statements have been excised"

I beg your pardon? On my original post, the entire set of emails has been reproduced. In the "Update" I took the substantive message.

"At no time did anyone threaten to contact his ISP the partial posting of his IP range and the owner of that range were simply to indicate to him that his information was known to us. "

Why then am I singled out for the honour of this threat?

Oh, and I had better delete myself for adopting "post fact, ipso fact" arguments because I am making the assumption that Hungry Valley and Mr Woodill are one and the same. The assumption is based upon attitude, language and tone at the least.

Why do you hide behind blind links, unattributed memberships? There are others in this world who have the courage of their own beliefs, and security in their own identity. And, while you might not believe this sir; some of those - many of them - are American, and a goodly number are definitely Republican.

None of them would I call "fascist". I have no knowledge of ever having called you (in fact I do not recall ever seeing your name at neocon's site) a fascist unless of course you are the very unlovely "Y...." - in whichever identity he is cloaked today. My approach is always "If it thinks like a 'x', talks like a 'x' then it must be a 'x'".

The blind political label of "right whinge" is my retaliation to the continual, meaningless and dogmatic mantra of "liberal".

In the meantime life goes on. I have replied to your "lawyer" this morning. Interesting dude to say the least! I might get around to publishing that part of the correspondance in an update this evening.

Then, maybe not. It depends upon the state of my spleen after reading my mail tonight.

neoneoconned said...

my guess is this joker posts as senescent wasp...same attitude

why not send the whole lot to neo just in case she is unaware...although i suspet it is with her blessing.

Nasty bunch aren't they.

The probligo said...


I do not enjoy being rude.

I will decide how I speak with people on my pages. I will decide how people will be treated.

I thought your display on neo-neocon's site inexcuseable, unwarranted and impolite in the extreme. I thought their response was justified. I am more than just a little upset that I appear to have been caught in the crossfire.

I will work that out. I have no need of your help, or the chorus from the bleachers.

If I can give a few words of advice they would be; find some other means of self-expression. Your present form is approaching that of dunny drawings, done badly from an incomplete memory.

Sally said...

Just a word of support, Bob, assuming your emails from "Michael H. Woodhill" are genuine. Whatever criticisms anyone might have of your positions, posting, or even debating style -- and I have some, as you no doubt know -- this guy comes across as the quintessential Pompous Ass, particularly in the "not to be quoted or forwarded" part, which I'm glad to see you quoted.

I'm also, BTW, happy to see your reply to conned, who really is just a troll.

neoneoconned said...

ok fair enough you only saw the end of a long drawn out engagement. I started on the site being reasonable, was abused accused of being a troll - simply for disagreeing, shouted down endlessly and threatened - albeit rather unrealistically.

So the neoneoconned identity was a little invention to show what a troll really was. it was constructed to be thrown off and, once neo said banned i went, although that took rather a long time.

Sorry if you feel caught in the crossfire but I think if you keep a regular eye on neo's site you will observe a constant pattern of liberal appears, gets attacked, argues back, gets called a troll.

This becomes irritating, as however you behave you get the same response - look at the way they talk to you. do you think these neo-cons actually care about subtlety?

Anyway sorry if i pissed you off, it was not intended. good luck with mr woodhill

Sally said...

PS: re conned's comment above -- I saw the start of the "long drawn out engagement", and he was a garden variety troll from the beginning.

confusedforeigner said...


you truly are a wide eyed fool. Do you really think these eejits care what the F a kiwi thinks or what the Clark government practises? Some of you kiwis can be incredibly naive. You are one of the naivest (is that a word?) to discover the interweb.

You've abused both me and conned for reacting in a manner that was far more adult and robust than your little whinge here.

I mean "cover your ears ladies" ? Purleeeease for chrissakes, grow up.

Senescent Wasp is a charmer ain't he? That's your Mr Woodhill, I would suggest. Neo is one piece of work eh? Worthy of your respect still?

And you still haven't put together the other naysayers reactions?

BTW Sally has one hell of a nerve posting here.

confusedforeigner said...

Oh nad BYW prob, before you point the finger at other people for being rude, consider a) knowing the full story before venting your little spleen and b) where I come from, it is considered rude and ignorant to ignore a direct question.

Consider your own manners and responses before judging others. Another annoying kiwi trait. You can be very similar to Americans at times.

confusedforeigner said...

Seems the wasp is a trainspotter.

confusedforeigner said...

PS: re conned's comment above -- I saw the start of the "long drawn out engagement", and he was a garden variety troll from the beginning.
# posted by Sally : 6:53 PM

Yeah right sally, I believe you. Hee hee.

neoneoconned said...

hmmm not really wanting to start another stupid argument but you didnt see the start sally as i was posting under another name.

Sally said...

... as I was posting under another name

Yes, that was evident, conned.

The probligo said...

Sally, thanks and kia ora.

Confude, can you see any difference between your contribution and that of MHW or conned?

At least conned has had the grace to apologise. Apology accepted, conned. I still think that your approach to commenting on neo's site stinks. I withdraw half of my comment about your dunny drawings.

confusedforeigner said...

I can see the conned is a more tactful and patient person than I.

I lost patience at neo's very quickly when I had dozens of diatribes posted, none of which addressed my arguments.

I have little time for people like you who are a) too rude and ignorant to answer a direct question and b) attack others (citing illmanners for gawdssake) for reacting to slander and threats without taking the time to consider the circumstances.

Now you are getting the same treatment, behaving badly and still can't join the dots. Good on yer mate. You're a genius.

Little wonder I take so much money out of NZ every year with competition like you.

I'll give you a kiwi apology if it makes you feel better though.

Sorry you feel that way.

confusedforeigner said...

Sally, I used to meet people like you a lot when I was in the bankruptcy and insolvency business. You're not as smart as you think you are. And Ariel couldn't manipulate his way out of a wet paper bag.

Cut out the psychobabble and personal insult and you may see the woods one day.

The probligo said...


Your putative condescension, your unrivalled perspicacity, and your unsurpassed ability for insult all mark you as Australian, even without the addition of the avatar.

That you describe your own work as “diatribes” is apt, and truthful.

I have no doubt that with the right referee, and a tail wind in both halves, the Socceroos might have won the World Cup.


Sally, he is not normal company.

confusedforeigner said...

Ummmm, a good example of your skills on offer here. The diatribes were from others aimed at me.

Yeah mate Australia is a terrible place and we are very mean to you Kiwis. I don't know how the 13% of your citizenry that live here can stand it.

Maybe I am condescending. I've never suffered fools gladly. Your unctuous grovelling to neo and sally betrays you, but it didn't and won't do you any good. You're either being obtuse or stupid.

Enjoy the threats. Enjoy whining about the threats on your blog. Enjoy living on your knees.

Some of us chose to fight fire with fire.

Have a nice day now, y'hear.

confusedforeigner said...

Oh BTW thanks for...

"your unrivalled perspicacity"

....I missed that the first time round.

PS I wasn't having a go at Kiwis in general, just your particular type. You are as patently narrow-minded as those you are criticising.

Have a nice "clean green" life. Heehee.